Good morning, listeners. Oh my gosh, I'm so excited. You guys, has this not been the craziest week? Like the weather, mother nature, all over the place is just like being chaotic. Tornadoes, heat, oh my gosh, you name it. It's just been a little bit of a tumultuous week. And I cannot tell you how excited I am to take a chaotic week and wrap it up into this beautiful package of who I get to talk to today. But first, thank you for joining me. I am Cameron Matheny, principal of Cameo Studio Designs, host here, visionary, recognized also for the concept designer, Dopamine. And as you know, this podcast is proudly presented by the WOFB, Flourish and Flooring, Flourish and Business, Flourish and All Things. It is also sponsored by Laticry and my company, Cameo Studio Designs. I cannot, I'm waiting for everything at the end because I'm so excited to get on board today. I am joined with Jane Callowert, Dragonfly Tile and Stone Works, Inc. I know all you tile people know who she is and her husband, Lee. But listen, their business was founded in 2003 by her and her husband. Jane is the leader in the tile artisan movement, which I am so honored to learn more about today, as you guys are too. This is an artisan trade that is restoring its artistic value. And without further ado, here she is. Welcome. Thank you. It's a lovely, lovely opportunity to be with you. Thank you so much. You are so welcome. I'm so honored. Like, think whenever I think of like you and think of your husband and everything you guys are doing in the trade, all I think about is like trailblazing. All I think about is this path and, and all of this stuff you guys are doing. So I am like honored. It's my pleasure. It really is. Yeah. Yeah. I'm sure that it is. So I'm just going to dive right in with you because like everything about you, I'm just so interested. And what about your background though? Tell me what is happening in your background. Where I am right this minute, physically. Yeah. Yeah, people laugh about that when we get on Zoom calls and stuff, but we have a rather unusual home. And I don't know what we call this room. We tend to name all of our rooms, but this one has really struggled for an identity. It houses my office and our music. We are very much a musical family. And it's kind of this all-purpose room. I don't know. Sometimes I call it the cave. It's obviously got a lot of stone in it. And other times my husband calls it the salon. And I don't know. It's just, it's a room. It's a room that's kind of funky and high ceilings and a little arty. Yeah. It speaks. It's so cool. I love it. Love it. Megan Rink would love a spot like that. I know that. Yeah. Yeah. She might. Yeah. Yeah. So also tell me, so those of you who can't visually see this podcast, the backsplash of the podcast is a photo that I took from your website and it's this beautiful gold mosaic. It looks like it has some mother of pearl details. But those of you who can see this, you're going to understand when Jane describes this, how beautiful this is. Can you tell me a little bit of what I've pulled, what this picture is? Oh, yeah. One of my favorite projects, and it was something that was in the works for years for a long, long time client who... was a big supporter of the arts and had a lovely historical home or has here in Milwaukee area. And she just loved art. We've done some interesting artisan work in her home over the years, but she had this idea about somehow incorporating something to do with the orchestra into her foyer. And so Lee and she got to talking about it. And Lee said, well, let's just make the story. There's always a story. The story was the kind of what was the inspiration was maybe like the orchestra finishes their final performance, they go to the opera party, they drop their instruments on the floor, kick off their shoes and pop the champagne. And you can actually, I don't know if you can see it on the screen, but behind maybe me is a bottle of champagne that's kind of spilling out and the shoes are over on the other side. the old wingback shoes. And so the whole idea was celebrating and the orchestras dropping their instruments, kicking off their shoes, popping the champagne. And so with that inspiration in mind, Lee went about designing every instrument and, some of them from real instruments. You know, his grandfather's saxophone was one of the pieces that he studied and drew and designed it based on that. And he really wanted to get perspective and depth so that the instruments looked like they were just kind of dropped in different ways, not dropped, but set in different ways. And then he, I think, I can't remember how many instruments are in here, but he cut those all out by hand. He designed them, you know, templated them. cut them out by hand and then pre-mounted them. That's a method with a method that we finally got approved, proved in our industry. And then he had them cut into, he, this is a 2CM marble and the field tile and we decided that in this case, he was going to work with a water jet company to actually be able to put them in because otherwise it's just too thick for him to handle. Normally he hand cuts everything himself. So that was a fun experiment, I might add. We got to work with an amazing woman that has a small business here in the area. And she'd never done anything like this before. She worked primarily with metal, but she had all the equipment to do so. So it was kind of a learning experience for her. So it was a journey for everybody, really, this whole project was. But we had so much fun with it. And then, of course, there was a lot of other work being done in the home. So it took some time before we actually were able to install it. And one of our uh, dear friends, uh, came in from Colorado and Seth Reddy, who has been part of our artisan training that we've been doing now for several years. And he said, I just want to come help. I want to come. And so, um, he came in and obviously with our apprentice, Maria, uh, the three of them installed this into that historic home is as a foyer. And it's, it's true. I would, nothing can capture it is, you know, how that is. You just can't quite capture it. And of course there was still work being done around it. So some of the final photos are yet to be displayed, but yeah, It's I just love it. I think it's that's the beautiful piece of what it is that you guys do as an artist and movement as you're able to. And I appreciate this, but you're able to take a vision from someone and actually have the skill and implementation and tools in your tool bag to implement that vision. um seeing something like this you know in our industry and I'm sure you know her from the artist village is you know allison mullen or uh allison eden allison eden does the you know some very beautiful mosaic pieces too but just that visionary in that art mind so for for what it is that we're talking about here tell me more about the revolution of tile you're making through the artisan movement you touched on it a little bit but dive into that with me some more Well, you know, Lee has felt, my husband Lee, he comes from a long line of artists. And when he did his apprenticeship over 40 years ago, he realized, you know, this is a creative craft. And so he has always approached it as an artisan, you know, looking for the fine details, the details. just the beauty that this particular surface can be. And what he had found or we had found is some time ago, he started saying, what happened? He said, you know, everything's becoming sort of, you know, it's just off the shelf. There's not as much creativity. And he always would say, bring back these, these hands. And so we really, we're seeing that we needed to restore the respect of our, for our craft as an artisan trade. It's the oldest art in history. And, you know, without, um, we just really needed to do something to bring greater awareness to that and, and to hopefully nurture that, that identity and provide the kinds of resources and education and training that can help people realize that they in fact are artists. They're not really just tile setters. And so that started that kind of all that thinking for years, he talked about that, but it really kicked off back in, in, 2019, Lee won the first ever Tilecraft Person of the Year Award. And one of the criteria that was considered in making that decision or selection was artisanship. So we had an opportunity to talk with some of the leaders at NTCA. I remember sitting with Bart Bedega and Lee saying, I was really happy to see that that was a criteria because that's been missing and we need to bring it back. And yeah, so that began the conversations. And Bart said, you know, would you do something at Coverings? And, you know, started talking about some ways to bring some more visibility to this. And we ended up, we had had some conversations with Joshua Nordstrom out of Tiara Tile, Alaska, because we had noted that he and Lee had a lot of similar methods and approaches to how they did their artisan work. And so we were able to bring him in to meet with us and to work with us here in Milwaukee to plan for the next coverings program and to do an artisanship in tile demonstration. And we sat around our table. five years ago, whatever, yeah, I don't know, four years ago, we sat around our table and just realized that we had a lot of the same visions, you know, of what could happen. And that's when we said, well, you know what, we need to start a movement and we need to bring this back. And our initial intention was, you know, to bring visibility and education to this. And it just kind of, fortunately flourished and we're so honored to be part of it. We love that word. Well, it did. It flourished and beyond our dreams, really. The excitement about it and the recognition that this is really an important part of our trade. So we did work with Joshua on several coverings programs and he has become very, very close to us. Lee and Joshua are kind of brothers from another mother and he's been a very integral part of what we've been able to do together. The three of us kind of really are the team that started this, but we've had support from others that have come in when we've done training and helped us with that. But, but, but so it really, we started doing NTCA Artisan Roundtable Live. We started a Facebook group called the Tile Trade Artisans Guild. And the reason why is we said, you know, there is no such thing out there. It's, there are So many groups for tile, but who's really talking about the artisanship? And so we started that. It's been very fun because it's a really everybody's there for the same reason. And it's a collaborative and supportive. So that's been helpful. Obviously, we know now that there is a new tile letter artisan. Publication started several years ago, all born from this movement. Leslie Godden has been just an amazing supporter and team member in our efforts to bring awareness and give a voice to this. But I can still recall the day that she called us. Lee and I went up north to do a project that we'd been putting off for a long time. I remember getting out of the car, and my phone rang. And it was Leslie. She said, I've just been waiting to call you. So it wasn't too early in the morning. And she said, because I woke up with this epiphany last night. We need a tile letter artisan. And that publication is so beautiful. It's coffee table worthy. She and her team have done just an amazing job of putting that together, but it's to really highlight and bring visibility to all of the aspects of artisanship in our trade. We started, obviously, focused on the craftsperson as an artisan. And the tile setter Cresperson. And I took no time at all to realize, well, but it's a broader, you know, it's broader than that. There's all these amazing mosaic artists. You mentioned Alice and Eden, Angie Ray. I mean, there's just amazing mosaic artists throughout the country and the world. And I think that honestly, like what it is that you guys are doing and what you've done. I knew about the conversation, the roundtable conversation four years ago as that was brought to me. But for me to be able to lean on, you know, you guys and what it is that you're doing, it truly does give hope because, you know, I bring lighting into the orchestration of everything. For me, I brought lighting into the trade because here I saw this beautiful bathroom that was being designed and I saw the craftsmanship that went into it, but the shower itself, the space itself just looks so drab. And so being able to bring LED to shine a light on what can actually be done is a whole other conversation. And so hearing you and hearing where you guys started and where you are, that then gives me hope because four years ago, no one door after door was being closed because people were like, we're not going to put lighting in a space like that. How can you even integrate LED into a grout joint? So to hear you save these things and know that there is hope, and even for other people that are craftsmanships that are coming up with all of these different ideas, you know, not only does it pave the way for what you are doing as an artisan with the mosaic, but it starts to open the doors for groups like NTCA or other organizations to see like, you know, installing tile is one thing, but you have to have an open mind for where we're going as an entire unit, as an artisan, because there is lighting that is integrated. There is these glass components. There's all of this really cool stuff that's happening. So thank you from me and from others listening that you guys are in the position that you're in because you're getting people like Bart, you're getting people like these leaders in even communication like Leslie to hear you and to see these and just start dropping these nuggets and applying all of this information. So that to me- It's all under the umbrella of being able to do anything you can to enhance an installation. Tile is the jewelry, the jewelry. And if you can't, and obviously it needs to last forever too. So we're very much about standards, but it is the jewelry in any installation. And Lee has, one of the reasons that my husband has had the career that he's had is really related to the fact that he has looked at every single installation as art. And it doesn't necessarily mean that he's doing an elaborate 30 piece orchestra in the background. It means that He's looking at every possible opportunity to enhance that installation. And you're talking about the same thing. How do you enhance the environment? What can you do to make it even better? And I think that's why it's super important. And I know that this is passionate for you because you and I have talked about this. The same for me is this movement. It's so important for you because you're also an educator and your husband is is is an educator you you've been through you know the peaks and the valleys of what it means to be an amazing installer but you also have that education to back it and that that is like the the jam Well, that's the honor, you know, that's passing it down. And Lee has always said, you know, we lost so many really amazing craftsmen over the centuries that took their secrets with them to the grave. And that's unfortunate. And both Joshua and Lee, that was something that they articulated early on when we started this movement was that, you know, it took us so long to learn some of the methods and techniques and the things we've done it took us so long to learn those and to figure out the processes and the materials that work. And we need to make it easier for others so they don't have, they can learn from what we, our mistakes and all the trials and tribulations that we went through to get to this point. And that was really a goal that they both articulated very early on is we have to pass it on. And that's one of the reasons they started the guild. We have to be able to share. And I let other people learn it. And also at this point in our lives, we're really trying to look at kind of succession planning. You know, how do you, foster and mentor others in this particular part of our industry. And so that they can connect. And that's the true revolution of what you're doing as you're creating. You never would have had a place that you could go to. I mean, just listen to Alison Eden's story. She picked up a book at Home Depot to learn how to set tile for the first time at a Burger King. You know what I mean? And so all of those young men and women that are coming up behind you guys, coming up behind me, They they truly have this new art form that they can go to and lean on people that wasn't there for you, that wasn't there for Lee, that wasn't there for Allison or any other like true artisan in this industry. And that to me is like, again, that is you can't replace that. So that is where this this revolution that you guys are doing is it's creating that. Well, yeah, I hope so. We really see it as a need, not just because it is our craft, it is our history, but also, you know, we need to have, we need to attract more people to the trades. And this industry is so amazing and there are so many opportunities. I think that as a young person, you know, there's a great interest in wanting to be able to create, right? and work with hands. But perhaps the image and what we have told ourselves we are as tile setters for many years has lost some of that. And I think that it's very attractive to young people, many young people, to be able to have their trade be a creative outlet. And one of the things that we learned, and we've seen it with Lee, I mean, he was always known for this, when you approach every one of your installations, like it's art, even if you, like I said, even if you aren't doing, you know, some great big artisan inset, but you're looking at it with that eye, with that detail, with that, you know, you can't undo it. You know, this is part of, you become an artisan. And I might add, you become very much in demand because there are plenty of people out there who want art, art, even if it means the best, most detailed craftsmanship. And I mentioned the mosaic artists earlier. I also should say the handmade tile makers. I mean, look at the little handmade tile. And sometimes, you know, you might hear people say, oh, I don't like to install that because it's so hard. You know, it all used to be handmade. You know what I mean? Absolutely. It was all handmade tile. You know, you didn't go buy it off a shelf. It was all handmade. And so that's also part of our umbrella and the thing that, you know, we have been trying to work with others and trying to give a voice to others who are so talented, other artisans who are making tile, beautiful jewelry. And now they need us, too, to be able to install that. That's right. highest of standards. And we consider that an honor, you know, with another artisan's work, you know, it's like an honor. I got my hands on it too. And, uh, And there truly is an art form to the installation. And just like I shared with you earlier this week, I never will look at a bag of grout the same on a shelf after visiting the Latticree plant. Because not only do I know Ron Nash personally, know his team, I've had conversations with the sweaty men and women that were in the manufacturer because it was so hot as they're busting those bags. you know, and have met with a scientist and it's, it's the same thing. Like now I, I never, and it's been a long time since I've just been like, oh, that's great. Look at that tile. But like, I never look at tile the same because I know what goes into it from a perspective of the experience. It's art truly. Even whenever I walk into a bathroom at like you know, at a random place. And I'm like, oh man, that grout joint could have been a little bit better, but we never know what hands are installing that and from what perspective. So I love it that, you know, I'm never going to look at mosaic, the art, you know, the same ever again. Because I know, you know what, there is a man like Lee or there's someone like Allison that was behind a production or someone like a Jane that was in there, like having these deep conversations to push this to the level that we're now able to educate and bring this information to, you know, like I've said before, everyone coming up behind us. So I can give accolades all day long to what you guys are doing. I know. you know, firsthand what it's like to be a trailblazer on a very different level, though. So what you guys are doing, it supersedes anything that, you know, I could even have dreamt of, of where this would be going. So listeners know kind of, you know, where you are today. Those that are in the tile industry are aware of you know, what it is that you and Lee are doing, but I'm super interested to know you as to where you started and how you got to where you are today. So tell, tell, especially the women, there's so many women that listen to this show and we all talk about like our evolution of where we started and how we ended up in this industry. Can you share with us a little bit about that? Well, you know, I, I've been on the earth a while and, um, I had to had the honor of being born in the 50s and I graduated from college in 1977. Now, if somebody had told me 20, 30, well, 20, yes, but 30 years ago or 40, whatever, years ago that I would end up helping to manage a tile contracting business, of course, I would have thought that's the craziest thing I'd ever heard. You know, I actually started out, I just had a lot of wonderful opportunities. It was kind of pivotal in some industries, getting women getting involved in certain roles and careers back then. But I actually graduated from college with a degree in social work, medical social work, and I was specialized in that and chemical dependency and worked for a number of years in that. But I I got ANSI and I had an opportunity to get into pharmaceutical sales back when women weren't doing that, which was interesting. And from there, I really enjoyed the larger organizational And so I wanted to be hospitals only. And I ended up being recruited by a medical products company to work in sales for them. And ultimately, they moved me into management in their corporate office. And so I relocated and spent about six years in training and education. And I loved it. You have to find passion, you know, be open to a lot of things, but find your passion, be intentional and understand, you know, your motivation when you make those kinds of moves. And for me, I really I found myself going, oh, my gosh, I really love this people development thing. I really, really like it. I like the I like training. I like the career development. It made me feel good. That's where I got my my yeah. Yeah. This was so when I saw other people become better. Yeah. Result of something you had a little hand in. And that was really satisfying to me. I ultimately was recruited to actually move back to Minneapolis, which is where I'm from, and take over the global training and education department for the world's largest medical device company. And I'm a builder. I'm an architect for sure. And I was only 33 when I took that role and a woman. And it was the first year I thought, somebody just shoot me. This is so hard. I had a lot to learn, but I also was in a very interesting culture that was trying to evolve. And so to be a part of that was a lot of work and an honor at the same time, but I learned a lot. But I had an opportunity to not just put together systems on a global basis for training and for education and medical education, but also to have a hand in developing other people. And I like that part of managing people. Once again, it all just fit together. It was all about watching people get better and learning. So when the day come, I won't go through the whole in-between of all of that, but when when the day came after a number of life changes, I've been on and off a few trains and watched them go down the track and gained some perspective, hopefully from all of that. But here I was, Lee had an opportunity. I had taken a break for family and Lee had had an opportunity and made some changes and Lee had an opportunity. We became friends and he had an opportunity to start his own business from somebody came to him and said, a high-end contractor and a client that he had worked for said, I know you're going to go on your own someday. He had been working for a union shop and he was their high-end guru that would spend a year in a castle or something. So he had a good reputation at that point. And he... He had always wanted to go on his own. But then there's that other side of opening your own contracting business or any business. And so he came to me one day. We literally started Dragonfly overnight. Now, I had no idea this was something I was going to be doing for the next several decades of my life. But at that time, I said... well, what do you think about that? And we had to have some serious conversations. I wanted to know from him, why do you want to do this? I think I know intellectually, but I'd like to hear it from you. And he just looked at me and simply said, I really want to make a difference. I want to have a higher level of craftsmanship in this area. And I added in a higher level of service. And I said, well, maybe I can help you with that. And the next morning, we were at the accountant setting up our S-Core and I was learning that, I didn't even know what a quarter round was. I remember him handing it to me immediately. This story is all too familiar. He had two guys come immediately and say, oh, if you're leaving, I'm coming with you. So we had a team immediately and we literally did stay busy for a year for this one client. Well, we've for much longer, but they literally made it easy because they said, we can keep you and a team busy for a year. If you, if you come out with us and we can work directly with you. And so, so, but so I can remember Lee handing me this sheet of paper and saying, okay, can you call, you know, one of our supply, these suppliers and order this now, you know, again, back to, it's all about details, right? So there's very few installations that he ever did that didn't have like 15 components of tile. It wasn't just a, you know, it wasn't a 24 by 48 and some metal edge, you know, it was, you know, all these little pieces of, you know, tile that, um, it had to be in there. I didn't even know what they were. And I can remember calling the, um, the supplier, we actually had a conversation recently about this because she's still with them 20 years later too. And saying, you know, Sherry, can you help me? Because I don't even have any idea what I'm looking at here. And so that's where I, that's how much I didn't know, you know, about tile. But I learned to love it. And obviously it was able to bring some, some pretty Lee and I were, we were, We knew this was our mission. We were both committed to it. We wanted to bring a higher level of craftsmanship and service to tile in our area. That's what we, you know, we made sure we stayed very much aligned In that regard, we established some standards for how we wanted to operate as a business that our employees could also put their arms around. We really worked on becoming that higher level company that was trusted. And I can look back now and, you know, We did that. We did it. We have that market. We have that reputation. And it wasn't necessarily easy, but I think having... Lee and I, we're just kind of Mutt and Jeff. And we both have these different things we bring to the party. And I mean, I learned pretty early on. And it was about that time that we determined that we were going to make our relationship permanent. There was no question in mind. We had four boys between us that we said, we got to get the show on the road. These guys are number one. We got to solidify this. And they've all been able to grow up with a lot of, obviously, they all slept mud and hold tile and all that in their, in their days, but they have a very, um, they're very proud of, of the kind of, uh, organization that we built and the relationships that we've established in the area. Um, we're very, very lucky for that. But so, so, so to, so I didn't start in tile, but I took a lot of twists and turns and, um, every step of the way, you know, you take your risks, you, you have to, but you have to jump in sometimes. And, um, That was generally a decision. Yeah. And I love that because, I mean, I'm an entrepreneur. I've been an entrepreneur almost my whole life. And so I love the point that... You know, there's been businesses that I've had that have succeeded, businesses that I've had that have failed. And I think the key thing of what you said and those listeners listening right now, I'm talking with Jane Callowart of Dragonfly Tile Stone and Works. And she is talking about her history and kind of where she's been. what's led her to this moment. But the thing that I wanted to pull out of this is what really springboards with me. And I think a lot of other entrepreneurs is you take a risk. There's always risk. And you also go in business with people that You weren't a tile expert, but you sure did have someone in your life that was. You were a leader. The two of you knew both qualities, and you were able to mend that and bring that together. And as a business owner, like I tell people all the time, it really takes a true group to get you to doing those things that either you're not good at or someone else is. So having that trust component and pulling in. He pulled in those people right out of the gate. you know, the other installers that he already had that built relationship with. And that's truly what it's all about is just having that relationship and that trust in other people that you can lend them the reins to do what it is that they're best at. Absolutely. Oh, and not beating your drum, just doing it. Oh, yeah. I was kind of that way, you know, being kind of a A young woman years ago in very male-dominated careers, jobs, I always felt like, you know, it's okay to beat some drums, I understand, you know, but it was more important to me to just do and be a model for what can be done. Yes, there are challenges. Yes, yes, yes, yes. But I think that attitude helped me a lot. Yeah, it really did. And we've been fortunate too. You talk about bringing other people in. We've always been committed to passing it down in various ways, but certainly with our apprenticeships and helping to get young people learning to do things the right way and also getting the experience. And we've had such, we just, we've been very fortunate to be a part of some of their lives and their careers. And so, you know, we've been honored to have that. And then of course we started that training program, as you know, Artisans Revolution in Tile. Thank you to the industry. And you mentioned Leda Creed earlier and Ron Nash. And I have to tell you, We wouldn't have been able to do that without NTCA and LATICRETE, as well as we've had many other supporters. But they jumped in right away because it was the right thing to do. And bless you. And Ron is an artist, as you know. And he has really lent a lot of support and sponsorship to that and is committed to doing that in the future. Some people have been asking, we will do another program next year. Lee and I are going through some life changes. And so we will probably not do it in June next year. It'll probably be a little later. But we're working with the industry, with Bart and Ron and Ron's team. They've all been great. Leslie and And of course, Joshua and Lee and I for planning the next one because and more and more things. And what else can that look like? We're looking at smaller kind of episodes that can be virtual, that are related to things that are very important in understanding how to do artisan work. And so we have a lot of, a lot of things, a lot of good things in our future. So we're, we're excited. And so the last, the last group that you had walk me through real quick. So that was the tile. So you guys have the Facebook group, which is the tile group. Trade Artist and Guild. So let's just show that here for people. So tell me about, I saw some of my followers that were like taking pictures and like people posting that whole weekend. I talked to Gianna Valafueco the week of all of that. So she was just like the first 10 minutes of the podcast was what it was all about. But tell me about what that looks like and how people can learn more about it for maybe the next one. OK, well, that was another one of those things that we envisioned when we first started talking about the movement. And Josh, my background's in training and development. So, you know, there's standards for training. So it just so happened that Joshua, Lee and I were a pretty good team to start putting that together because I made him crazy. But it took us a year. Literally, and we would meet from Alaska to Wisconsin virtually every Saturday for quite a while, for hours, kind of going through the whole thing about what do we want to accomplish? It's really hard to do this in a short period of time. It's a lot to plan. You could use years, months learning these things. So we had to determine what's possible. How can we achieve something that's actually going to result in a change in behavior and And so we were very much based, basing it on what people would be capable of doing when they completed this particular workshop. And we came up with four days and it's really, really action packed and it's intense, but it's also about art and community. And I think it's just so, that's so important. And actually that's one of the wonderful things about having somebody like to have a moment to arrive in the morning. And Ron Nash was, did a wonderful presentation on the artist path, you know, and what does it mean to be an artist? Because there's a lot more to this than just learning to do the hands-on work. You know, as I said, Lee has always been an artist. I love being an artist. I know. You get that. So what does that mean? We are all artists in certain ways. And so what does that mean? So we had to try to create an atmosphere where that kind of creativity could occur. So in addition to the technical aspects and the tools and the methods that Joshua and Lee have used, we really tried to integrate into that the whole creative process and who we are as creative people. And you're not going to get that in corporate America, folks. Yeah, well, we certainly had some corporate help us out with it. And I find this whole tile industry is... It's pivotal. I think it's evolving in a really good way. I just love this industry. It's my favorite, favorite industry of humans ever. We've been so blessed to get to know and have lifelong friends as a result of this industry. But the training program, we did the first one last year, in June of last year, and we had to limit it to... Last year was actually 15 participants. We determined we could go to 16 and then no more because that's... of the experience. And it is very tool intensive. You know, we had eight rep saws here, eight ring saws here, shapers, you know, and we were amazed at the support from the manufacturers that, you know, got in there when they found out that we needed these tools. And it's just been really, really lovely. Well, that One of the goals was also to, as I mentioned earlier, we want to be mentors right now and to really look at developing people that can take this forward beyond us. And we were thrilled last year with what happened. All of the participants that came out of that program have demonstrated this growth and we have seen a renewed and sometimes new interest in the industry at large and how to get more involved. We've had young leaders programs. I think six of our graduates from last year were in the NDCA young leaders program. They have been doing, they went to Tile Fest and did a demonstration out there. They did a presentation at coverings. And so we've been all about coaching and providing them what help they needed to do that, but to do it themselves. Because, you know, we're always asked to do these things and say, well, we don't have to, but... And Leslie Godden has been very helpful in coordinating some of that as well. This year, we knew that we could take 16. The process is such that it is a little difficult in that, first of all, you do need to be an experienced tile craftsperson. This is not for the beginner. You need to be proficient with your tools. And we do have an application. We'd like to know what your intentions are. And also we asked the question, do you play well with others? And anybody that's gone through the program would know now why we asked that question. This is not a competition. This is a creative experience that we're all going through and it's individual and everybody will succeed, but this is not a competition. And so that's a very integral part of it. But so this year we ended up with 16 people We had a wait list both years and next year we intend to probably stick to the 16 applications as well. We do post the information on the Tile Trade Artisans Guild as we get closer and determine what our schedule is going to be. And it is there that we also provide the application. And the reason we do that is because it is limited to 16 people. To take it out too broadly would be just a nightmare. So we figure the people that are actually paying attention, either because they know people in the Artisans Guild are in that group or because they personally have been involved in that group, are probably the people that are most interested and actually demonstrating the interest in that. So that's how you learn about it. It probably, we do a lot of our planning in the fall. We will probably be after the first of the year talking more about the actual schedule for next year's program and where that will be. And people can find that on your Facebook group, you said. Also, do you, is it on your Dragonfly Facebook too, or your Dragonfly website? No, we haven't put it there. Oh, there's sometimes information. And that page is going to evolve because Lee and I, as you know, are going to be evolving ourselves into another chapter. And that page will probably stay up. But Lee's probably, we're going to get him off his knees. And Lee will be spending more time Obviously, we'll continue to support the industry in the various ways that we have professionally and also do training, of course. But also, he will continue to make artisan features, but they can be installed by others. And he's more than willing, of course, to consult on that. So we're going to be involved. Yes, absolutely. I'm not an installer, but I'm definitely a creator and have put in the work to make sure we can make this serviceable or else I would have never brought anything to the market. I'm going to send you guys a whole little package. Awesome. Having someone like that light it up. Oh, boy. Yeah, he likes to light it up. He definitely does. You have to know your materials, too. You know, I mean, he's pretty savvy with his materials. I don't know if you saw what Joshua Nordstrom did, that amazing work. What is it? The Borelli. How do you say that? Borellis. You know, Ariel Borellis or whatever. The big sky star display. Well, it's, of course, in Alaska. That's something they get to see sometimes. And he actually did that all. And it's all lit. You know, and it's beautiful. Yeah, it changes things. I laughed at, and then the different grouts, you know, you talk about the lighting and then as you just learned, there's so many different grouts that can also add illumination. Oh, yeah. I love the sparkle, all of that, the glasses. And there was that numerous of times. One of the funniest memories I have of our last class here was after they had grouted, someone had chosen the glow-in-the-dark grout for their piece. And we had a restroom inside that I asked the gentleman if they would mind if the ladies could just use it because there were so many people. And then we also had, of course, a portable outside, and the guys weren't great about it, sure. Well, so it said ladies restroom on the outside of our bathroom door. And so all of a sudden, someone looks up and all these guys are running into the ladies restroom and shutting the door, you know? And so someone actually caught a video of them all slowly coming out with, it says ladies only please. And they would come walking out and they're all, they were in there with the, it's the only place they could get the dark so they could see the glow in the dark, you know, all the boys, all the guys in the ladies restroom, checking out the glow in the dark. That's hilarious. What a great story. Thank you so much for sharing. Thank you so much for coming on today. Thank you so much for sharing all this great revolution work that you're doing as far as moving this whole artisan movement. It's truly packed with a bunch of passion. And I think you have so many supporters behind you. So keep doing what you're doing. Cameron, thank you. Thank you for doing what you're doing. You know, it's an important work and we have an amazing community of, of, of, everybody in tile. I mean, there's so many opportunities outside of, as you can see, I'm not the technical, you know, I don't, I'm not the one installing the tile, but there are so many opportunities to be involved and to be part of this incredible tile community. And I'm just glad to be there. And I'm so happy I got an opportunity to speak with you and you're just doing amazing stuff. Thank you. oh thank you as well um so again for those of you looking to catch up with all that um jane and her husband lee are doing this is their website the dragonflytile.com you can also find them on the facebook group at tile trade artisans guild and look out for more conversations on their facebook group Thank you so much for being on today. And I look forward to having further conversations with you in the future. Absolutely. Thank you, Cameron. Have a great weekend. All right. You too. Bye. Okay, guys, thank you so much. The WOFB, as you know, is a community of women in flooring, tile, stone. We're designers, entrepreneurs, women in lighting, architects, and so much more who, for me, through my voice, I am passionate about personal and business development and growth. Through this podcast, I aim to amplify the voices of women like you just heard from Jane, also from last week, Julie Ireland. and so many more throughout the industry. Last week was all about the 15 episodes that I've covered thus far and women truly standing in their power. So let's continue to empower each other through flourishing and business and life. Also, for those of you looking for enhancing your design space with lighting, please feel free to check out my website at cameostudiodesigns.com. And also, those of you that are looking for a CEU because you don't know about lighting, I offer Designer Dopamine, which is a way to enhance your tile and or space with more lighting. If you are interested in learning more about how you can be a sponsor, please check out podcast at women flooring.com. And also to our gracious sponsors who I love have had so many opportunities is hanging out with these guys is ladder creed.com. Um, they have some of the amazing materials that you can use for your installations. And those of you that are interested, um, and learning more about what we're offering here for the weeks to come. Um, I will be unpacking some more information of course, about designer dopamine, but more importantly, uh, talking with Georgia Ezra, who is the creative director of tile of Ezra, um, from Australia. And then one of my favorite people as well is Leslie Godden journalist and author through artisan magazine. So all amazing things coming down the pipeline. What a great show today that I had with Jane. I am so excited. Guys, every single time I talk to all of these women in the industry, I gain a new sister from another mister, a friend, just women and people that I can continue to support. So thank you so much for everyone who is listening today. And I look forward to talking with you next week. Thank you. Bye.
